Well, if we go to the history of wheel invention­ certainly we have many different prospects to comment,­ but if we stuck in the modern era of cycling-what I­ thought we discuss about-I don't see a reason to­ dispute team tactics, or individual achievement­ (Invention or evolution, maybe my term was wrong).­ Gladiator fights was suffering spectacles 2000 y.ago,­ but today we have ultimate fight or boxing, which­ stands up exactly for the same reason, but in different­ aspects like well managed machinery called sport. Same­ as cycling, or football, or every other professional­ sport.
Bruynel and his "team dynamics" or­ "brilliant tactics"-it is really choice of­ words, and misleading thesis AC working for AV on­ Dauphine, are well of this course-how can we define­ Vino's come back-as another accidental parachute in­ Astana?-someone to blame for 2010?-or maybe whole­ Astana team worked for AV on this years Vuelta Espana?­ Feeling bit tired of all doping affairs,­ who-where-why-with whom, AC vs. LA comparison....

And for the record Grand Tours were not invented as­ team competitions at all, they have merely evolved into­ team competiions in the last 50 years or so. ­ Originally, they were just a spectacle of suffering­ (certainly the case with the Tour), with most of the­ riders being independents travelling/competing under­ their own steam.

Interesting stuff. But from my perspective, there­ seemed to be little discontent in the Astana team­ during the 2007 & 2008 seasons, when AC was the GC­ team leader. He (and therefore the team) won the Giro,­ Vuelta and various other prestigious stage races and it­ all looked pretty harmonious to me. The problems with­ the 'team dynamic' only started when LA­ parachuted in - bottom line is LA is not used to­ playing second-fiddle to anyone. Anyway, I think­ during the Dauphine, AC showed he is prepared to work­ like a dog for a team leader - thing was the team­ leader in question was Alejandro Valverde of Caisee­ D'Epargne!!!

Grand tours are invented as a teams competitions, and I­ don't know why people waste his time resolving­ issues like is it team or leader counts. Of course­ there can be only one to stand on a podium as a winner­ in yellow, green, polka-dot etc.. AC won, Astana won (2­ podium finishes)-what we are talking about?? Agree,­ don't everyone speek spanish, and I am sure that­ Pistolero gave his gratitude as he should to his team.­ He prove his best this year both in single and team­ competition on the TdF, this discussion was not ment­ for this subject, nor for AC vs. LA rivalry. True team­ spirit Astana show in TTT, and no one on us can't­ take that from them. I like to think about myself as a­ true cycling fan following various races in the last 25­ years-watching on-site many of my personal­ favorites-Pedro, Miguel, Marko, Lance and now Alberto.­ I sincerely understand American spirit and claims that­ LA is a cycling God. Can understand Spaniards also­ claiming cycling as a professional and national sport­ No.1. And both have right to do that summarizing last­ 20y. results on a grand tours. Nobody can't deny­ fact that media focus last years is more of the road­ rather than where battle goes on. Liking AC doesn't­ automatically disrespects LA, or someone else. LA is an­ institution and history and analysis in the future­ belongs to him. He raise the sport on a many different­ levels-team prerogative, science approach, top­ professionalism, commercial and socially phenomenon,­ and like to hear someone disputing those facts. AC is a­ presence of this sport and is normally liking/disliking­ him-all a.m. guys went thru that-but for now results­ are what we all counting-and he is proving to be on the­ right side of the track. Strongest team as Astana this­ year, or weak one just to prove himself-is a simple­ manipulation of the terms. Teams like Banesto,­ USPS/DSC, T-Mobile etc. can't emerge by the night­ with simple shopping of few experience riders, few­ youngsters and one or two GC c

Singletrack...i think Contador has clearly shown that­ when the @#$% goes up...he is the best...clearly. And­ i think he always has shown respect for his team­ mates...maybe u dont speak spanish...i do...and he is­ always thankfull to them. Oh ya ...without a good team­ in the present day cycling u dont win anything.

Just for the record singletrack....LA didnt have a­ superstrong team his first 2 tour wins...but I­ completely agree with you on everything you wrote.

I'm not from the US and I can't stand AC.­ @pedro118118 it takes a strong team to get a GC rider­ to the front and up the mountain. Evans is strong­ enough to win but never had the team around him to get­ him into position. This is why he was forced to be a­ wheel suck and settle for second best. Lance won all­ his tours because of his team. Sastre leaves Saxo bank­ and completely bombs, Cavendish wins his sprints­ because of his team. The list goes on and on. Has­ Contador ever given credit where credit is due?­ Cavendish is a snot nose brat and is as cocky as any­ rider in the peloton but at the end of the day he gives­ credit to the boys who put him in the position to take­ the win. This is why I want to see him (AC) on an­ average team with average climbers. If he can win under­ those circumstances then I will eat my words. Until­ then he should be respectful and thankful for the­ people who helped him get to the top step of the­ podium. Even he realizes this. He has said he wants to­ go to a team who gives him the best chance to win! That­ doesn't sound like a guy who is confident he can do­ it on his own.

This guy has no idea what a "team" is. He­ only knows "I". He couldn't be a teammate­ to any of the Astana riders, he went to a corner and­ hide during the TDF from his mates.
He is a great rider­ but will never be respected by his fellow riders.

I suppose I can understand the anti-Contador sentiment­ from US fans - what with him handing out a beating to­ Armstrong et al this year. That said, there has to be­ some element of realism. Frankly CVV is not a­ contender for the GC in a major Tour - the top five is­ as good as he's ever going to get, which let's­ face it, is pretty good! Like it or not, Contador is­ the best/most explosive climber and has now matured­ into the best TT rider of the main GC contenders. If­ someone can tell me how the likes of CVV, Evans,­ Menchov, Armstrong, Wiggo etc are going to put 5 mins­ into Cantodor over a three week Tour, then I'm all­ ears. Let's face it, Contador is capable to­ gaining 5 mins in a couple of tough mountain stages.

Very good analysis pedro118118. Simple facts and­ nothing more-we got more information in your review­ than in the whole article. My sincere compliments to­ you. Keep on going that way.

@Thomas - why feel the need to spout unsubstanciated­ garbage? As for the great LA v AC debate, the Tour­ this year proved it to be a no-contest. LA finished­ 3rd on the back of a very strong team. At no point­ throughout the 3 weeks did he look capable of shaping­ the race in his favour. The time gained over the other­ GC contenders was in the TTT and being the right side­ of a wind-driven split in the first week. In the­ mountains he was hanging on to the lead group and in­ the ITTs he was well off the pace. He (LA) will do­ well to finish in the top 10 in 2010. That's not­ an attack or an example of being a Lance-hater,­ it's a phisiological fact - there are younger,­ stronger riders out there...............he's not­ Peter Pan!

I don't know why everyone is making such a big deal­ about the AC / LC rivalry. In the latest issue of­ Cyclesport N.A. AC is quoted in saying "I am­ stronger then Lance". Least we forget LC is 10­ years the senior to AC and is at the end of his career.­ So Alberto, you should be stronger then Lance! Sure­ it's great for the sport in the US to create such a­ rivalry but I find it a bit repulsive! I really hope­ neither Lance or AC wins the tour, I'm tired of­ hearing about these two spoiled brats and the media­ fanning the flames of their egos. What I am eager to­ find out is if AC can in fact win a tour without­ Bruyneel and the power house teams he once had built­ around him. I say prove to the world how strong you are­ AC. Stay with Astana regardless of how strong the team­ is around you and prove you are the worlds greatest­ grand tour competitor and you did, without a doubt, win­ last year on your own. Put your money where your mouth­ is.

Seems clear to me that Contador's preference is­ Caisse D'Epargne - they're Spanish. Failing­ that, probably Garmin, as they are a well balanced­ squad - they just need someone capable of winning a big­ Tour, as the likes of Zabriskie, Wiggins and VDV are­ nearly men. The main advantages of Quick Step are a)­ they have deep pockets, b) have no other stage race­ leader, who's nose would be put out of joint and c)­ they would provide the best possble bodyguards to AC in­ the first week of the Tour 2010. The wind and cobbles­ would be much less scary wiht the likes of Boonen,­ Devolder, De Jongh riding for you. The likes of­ Devolder, Seeldraeyers and Chavanel can all climb, too.

HAHAHAHA, great joke. Liquigas is not in game at all,­ CSE also. QST and Garmin maybe, maybe QST only. And who­ in the world is interested where Alberto plan to­ continue? Great rider-no questions ask, multiple tour­ winner, from now on-no question for that too, but why­ the hell he is bothering the whole world cycling­ audience with such a stupid "dillema"? All­ the great riders in the past had no problem to form a­ team around them-and did anyone ask why Alberto have­ this situation? There are too many great managers in­ the world for him to sit and wait thinking what about­ next season. Rider with his proportion should be in a­ position to choose between teammates and teams, and not­ to waist his time misdirecting cycling fans with his­ whereabouts. I am one of his big fans and supporters,­ but I like to express my biggest frustration not seeing­ him on a bike since july and the tour. No Vuelta, no­ World Champs, no classics...???? Regarding Radio Shack­ interference I think that every chance this team to get­ some victory lays on LA credits, and we all know what­ he is capable off, so leave the old man to promote the­ sport and its commercial prospects, and focus on a real­ competitors for next year like Wiggins, Kreuziger,­ Niballi, Schleks and many youngsters, not forgeting­ Valverde, Basso etc. On a long run Astana doesn't­ seems like a poor choice to stay with-depending the­ team strategy and politics, but as soon he is out of­ it, looks better for him to score in 2010 tour.­ It's simply as that, and he should have made this­ choice since now. Time to form completely new­ surrounding is short for 2010, to join Garmin or CSE is­ a tricky thing to do facing Wiggins, Vandevelde and­ Valverde, and in the other way he have enough people­ left in Astana to go thru 2010 tour with yellow jersey­ on his back.

contador just go to garmin and let wiggo go to sky­ because this is just boring now

Pesata for your thoughts Valverde?

If AC stays in Astana than he is a bit of a coward as­ he clearly indicated he doesn't want to ride with­ them next year.

But lets not get blinded by "who­ made what promise" because Astana can in fact be a­ good team for AC to defend TdF title. I believe Vino­ will support AC and he himself will aim for a different­ big tour win. It may most likely be Giro as it promises­ lots of TT and generally tough days, and he is a tough­ man (I don't like him much but those are plain­ facts).

The only other option I believe AC has is to­ go to Caisse d'Epargne. As a current Spanish Tour­ champ they will give him all the support he wants since­ he would be in a Spanish team. The same was true for­ Indurain in Banesto team. Spanish are very proud people­ and will give everything if some one proves to be up­ for the challenge.