Liverpool Message Board
Just as the heading says..
Looking at results against weaker opposition Oldham in particular..
Our second string should've been good enough to thrash Oldham..
Yet it seems evident to me they're not even fit to play in the Championship let alone inthe EPL..
So I say again are our players good enough to play for us when we've plans to but up at the top..
Some aren't obviously. They can have all the skill in the world, but if they don't have the right mental attitude, it doesn't mean sh!t. I am thinking Coates, Borini looks lost, I'm worried about Allen's self- confidence, the full back positions are a major problem beyond the first team, and Stirling is out of his depth coz he needs a rest. Lucas' fitness is also a worry.
Don't under-estimate the size of the task confronting Rodgers. It will take time to fully overhaul the squad. We can't bring too many in at once, we have to grow as a unit and then hopefully, like the old days we just bring in one or two faces a season to continually improve the squad.
Forgive me all but I thought that when you turn 18, you become a man in this country. Didn't Brendan send out 11 men against Oldham? It seems to me so hypocritical to be talking about 'molly-coddled footballers' then when someone has a justifiable go at them outrage spills out from some quarters.
We need our boys to man-up, and man-up fast. If they're mortally offended by the dose of medicine they got from Brendan, then they can p!ss off to the lower leagues. Its a good managers role to apportion b0llockings when it is deserved, you cant endlessly praise otherwise complacency creeps in. Fear should be a motivating factor as well as the cuddle. I mean, its not worked out too badly for Fergie has it?
Don't get me wrong, the 3 envelope thing was an absolute pile of cr@p, but if you look at what Brendan has said compared to Harry Redknapp, it was sod all! If don't want to be treated like a turkey, then don't play like one!!
Colin, you think that it’s poor management to call out a player in public. Fair enough it’s your view.
However I do need to ask, if it’s bad form for a manager to be critical in public, why is it acceptable for the general public and you particularly to round on players, and actually call them out by name? I understand you’re not the manager so maybe not the best parallel, however it does imply you'd agree you'd make a crap manager.
Also, do you then think there were alternatives to getting both Jose and Downing back to top form? It’s a what if question so maybe there is no answer and we'll not know if either a hairdryer or a cuddle in private would have worked, however it’s hard to deny the tactic actually used actually worked. I wonder also if Allen would have stood up in public as he did today if he'd not been challenged in public.
Lastly, are you also saying that Harry Redknapp is also a poor manager, as I think it’s fair to say he went a lot further with his public utterings about his players than BR did? Personally I rate Harry. Not sure if he's going to be able to keep QPR up, but to be honest if he can't I’m not sure there is a manager around who could. But in my view it’s exactly the tactics he's been using to galvanize the squad, to weed out who is working for the cause and who is not, that is his and their clubs best chance at prem survival.
I can undertsand that but he didn't single out any individuals and I've no problem with having a go at them when they didn't put the effort in.
They are now fully aware that they need to step the effort up.
If, on the otherhand, they bust a gut and were beaten because they weren't good enough and then Rodgers has a go then I completely agree with you. That's wrong and more than likely damaging.
To me it seems that a few in the squad need to be reminded that they need to be prepared to "run through brick walls". That seems to have been forgotten by some.
dsteer ...Dave as u say Im not the manager so if Im frustrated by our performance Im going to vent on here. Its a very different thing when a fan calls out from the stand a players name and calls him a carthorse or a donkey or a muppet or what have u ...even worse when large sections of the crowd groan when the ball finds its way to a player who has found his way into their displeasure...but they are the paying fans and entitled to their ideas about the players.
IF I were the manager...no I wouldnt call these lads out in public but I might strongly express my dispeasure with the performance and attitude of a few of them behind closed doors. Where I do agree with BR is if he has genuinely identified some particular trait that has taken hold within a certain clique of players that he finds unhealthy for the club and is threatening those players with expulsion from the club unless they rapidly adjust their attitudes if this is the case then Im actually all for his attitude to let the public know all about this crew. Lets face it these lads are being afforded the chance to earn fortunes by the average working mans standards and earn that via doing exactlywhat so many other hundreds of thousands of us wish we had had the chance to do ...if they abuse that priviledge then they deserve all that BR and if necessary the heirarchy of FSG want to dole out too.
Colin I think I answered this post on a different thread, so just in case you missed it, wanted to tell you to not take the crap manager comment too seriously. I was just being cheeky, which does not always come across on a message board, but if we were down the pub I think you would have laughed about it.
To be honest Ron I think this might be a bit of a generational thing. The old school way is to keep things in house, and maybe that is the better way to be fair. However I think the days of players being intimidated by a managers private words are behind us. These boys just make way too much money and know if one gaffer goes off them, there are dozens of r other managers just falling over themselves willing to give them love. Therefore if the private warning (I assume words were spoken at halftime) was not heeded, then public words at full time it had to be.
But, on the words are cheap comment, I am old enough to agree with you 100%, the proof really is in the pudding. But so far we've seen a number of lads step up and say they want to fight for the shirt, and they have, so hopefully we have a collective strong sense of character in the dressing room. And, if there are detractors to that I'm sure (or hope) they'll be shown the door in the summer.
Here's aquestion fo all of us building on comments above.
Do we honestly think that all of our recent signings will become part of the final squad that ultimately delivers our needs and wants of Europe and the PL title?
or should we all actaully be a little bit pragmatic and realise that some player will only take you so far, some not ery far at all and we should therefore expect some turnover with players coming and going all the time?
The latter seems more logical to me. I fully understand and I'm guilty of it myself that every time the club spends money on a player that we hope that this player is next key ingredient in a title winning side.
In all honesty I don't think that is in any way possible. It wasn't for any side that I've known that's for sure.
I think it’s highly unlikely all the recent signings will be part of what we hope in a few years is a title winning squad. Fact is not all signings work out the way you want them to, and even the best managers cannot predict perfectly.
We've invested a lot in younger players, both by promoting from the reserves, and bringing in players in their early 20s not yet at their prime. Some of these we hope will develop to the potential we think they can reach. Some I can dream will surpass our expectations. But some I'm afraid are bound to fall backwards. Some may stay as squad players, but others will have to be moved on.
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