Tottenham Hotspur Message Board
- Dogstar Dogstar Feb 28, 2013 09:07 Flag
The new format is a load of b*ll*cks!! I've had to reply to my posts in response to someone else's which makes the whole thing very confusing. Maybe this was to stop long-winded threads consisting of 2 or 3 people abusing one another but it's not exactly ideal.
- Dogstar Dogstar Feb 27, 2013 17:29 Flag
Sfer - chill out man! I'm not here to argue, I take your points on board but think you're being harsh on us. Whatever you say about Arsenal without RVP, they still have a chance of qualifying for the CL again, and could even finish 3rd - if we falter and Chelsea (both are likely). What I meant as well is that we have Bale - for now - and he's been our best player so naturally our other players will look to him first for inspiration. Currently that's working.
Re Holtby getting a "real kicking", not saying he was kicked but I thought he encountered a more physical team than what he's probably used to and wasn't getting any joy in the second half. The ref wasn't offering protection and he ended up on his a*se a lot. So AVB substituted him for someone who is more used to the physical demands of the PL and what happened? He nearly scored with his shot that spilled onto the post when Ade then missed his chance, and afterwards did manage to score our equaliser - however scrappy it was he was there to put it away.
Re Dembele/Carroll - turn that question on its head, how many goals scored and assists created for Dembele? Not many considering he's had more game time but that's because he sits deep. He'd also been booked and had one or two moments where he could have got a second yellow, so taking him off for Carroll (rather than a defensive player) was the right move.
As for your argument on defence/goalie not winning games, not sure many Arsenal fans would agree with you given that they have not had a solid back 5 (including goalie) for years whereas the likes of Chelsea have had Cech, Terry, Carvalho, Cole and Man U have had Vidic, Ferdinand and Evra - and have won trophies. You can't say that Arsenal have been light in attacking options over the last 7 years while they still had Henry, RVP, Fabregas, Walcott etc.? Many feel it is that lack of a quality back line (+ goalie) which has cost them games, competitions, success.
Maybe some teams do deserve better, and if West Ham had the quality they we do (or Bale if that's the case) then they may have got that. Ditto for a whole host of other teams over the years. I support AVB at the moment, but I'm not sure on Levy - why no players in January again etc. etc. r
- Dogstar Dogstar Feb 26, 2013 13:23 Flag
Where's the sense in saying without Bale where would we be? We have him and if he's the one we need to rely on at the moment then so be it - what about Man U when Ronaldo was playing for them? Are we supposed to feel bad that we have such a great player in our team who can change games for us? Arsenal had it with Van Persie last season and got into the CL as a result - at our expense. If you remove Bale from the team then someone else would step up, that's the way it usually works. He wasn't playing that well earlier on in the season and yet we were still picking up points.
West Ham came at us last night after having two weeks off, fresh as daisies, whereas we'd had 2 Euro matches. We may have started poor and West Ham fought harder than us but the fact is we created the better chances, their GK having to make some extraordinary saves and we kept pushing to the end until we got the last minute thing of beauty from Bale.
As for the substitutions, Holtby was getting a real kicking out there in the second half and not able to influence the games. He'll learn that teams scrapping for anything in the PL will do that but until then AVB is right to ease him into premier league football the way he has been, so that he doesn't end up overcommitting, getting frustrated etc. Dembele gives us more presence in central midfield which is probably why he was kept on, but the fact he was taken off for a more attack minded Carroll minutes before our equaliser shows that knows what he's doing. It's not AVB's fault that there wasn't another striker to bring on. Livermore didn't do anything wrong when he came on and even had a hand in the winning goal, passing out from the edge of our penalty box.
Name me any one team in this year's premier league that has played consistently well over the course of the season. We haven't been playing that well and yet winning games as a result. Not all because of Bale - how about the performances of Lloris? Dawson? Walker's picked it up lately, Dembele against Man U, Lennon for the most part, Holtby giving teams someone else to worry about? Maybe we'll struggle towards the end when we're burned out and not finish in the Top 4. But if we are there, we would have deserved it - the table doesn't lie.
- Dogstar Dogstar Feb 14, 2013 14:22 Flag
If this is in anyway directed at me due to a recent response to one of your posts LTS can I please just state this for the record?
I am 100% behind AVB and the team. I think he is obviously is great coach given what he has achieved for Porto and he is still learning. What I am skeptical about is Levy and the board - I know that there is a lot that goes on behind the scenes which we do not know about, but I often find that there's a reluctance to strengthen our squad when we need to for short term gains such as securing a champions league spot at the end of the season, which can surely only help our long term strategy (which you alluded to in that post?)
You yourself mentioned Harry failed to get us in the champions league 2 years in a row, and maybe that's because he lacks the top level management experience (balancing CL with PL) or maybe it's because Levy didn't invest enough over those two seasons in the areas we needed? Most likely a combination of the two.
I'm not whingeing, I've been supporting Spurs long enough to know we don't have it too bad at the moment, but that doesn't mean we (as fans) shouldn't be expecting us to aim higher, win trophies, get established etc. - and not have to wait another 5-10 years for it. Our time is now, with the players we've had, but we risk losing our best players if we fail to get CL football and then we're having to rebuild again.
Yes but by ignoring the gambles on strikers during transfer windows, we end up missing out on champions league football and are forced to sell our best players without having any replacements of equivalent quality.
Ba, Michu, Suarez, Llorente, Rossi, Damaio - all linked with us in recent seasons and what we've seen is them make a huge impact at other clubs. On the other hand we've ended up with Saha and Pienaar in recent seasons who had very little risk associated with them - both flops.
There comes a point where you must consider your short term strategy and see how it can benefit you long term - champions league football brings a £20m windfall, ability to attract better quality young players (20-22), ability to retain top talent due to guarantee of CL football, more money from tickets, TV etc. and so on. It's worth the initial outlay in a proven quality striker. On the other hand, failure to do so when other teams around us do means we could lose out on CL football, unable to keep our best talent, unable to attract the best young talent and lose potential TV revenues. So we have to spend more time looking for these supposed potential players who want to come to us, and the risk is higher because we don't have enough quality players to begin with.
- Dogstar Dogstar Jan 18, 2013 14:46 Flag
I think AVB has received a lot of unfair criticism no matter what he does. Some Spurs fans and the media baulked at the idea of us playing 4-5-1 saying we were crying out for a 4-4-2. Recently, he's been called into question for not realising that Adebayor and Defoe cannot play together.
The media asking him about his handling of Lloris looking for any excuse to show him up - now Lloris is settling and playing well I'd say AVB did a good job here and is right to say he'll play players based on merit, not reputation.
He has had to work with a new look attacking midfield following the departure of our two most creative players, and despite how average Sigurdsson and Dempsey have been is working with them to try and get the best out of them (Dempsey said so himself in an interview).
AVB also doesn't talk complete codsh*t to the media nor contradict himself. Time will tell if he's able to steer us to any kind of success but it's the same old story with Levy - not investing in the squad when we need it, letting players slip by and join our rivals. If we do finish in the top 4 this season that'd be a phenomenal achievement, but if we don't I would not write AVB off at all just yet, and allow him time - and money - to build a great team.
- Dogstar Dogstar Dec 21, 2012 15:02 Flag
Ha! I'll give Stoke credit and say that their way of playing the game has been effective and kept them in the league. Agree that their tactics can be dirty, but it's the same sort of tactics that the top teams have employed for years - just that they manage to produce some quality attacking play as well so we don't mind!!
Can't stand Huth though!! Or Adam (who isn't playing tomorrow luckily for us)
Dembele's says he prefers starting deeper now because it allows him to see the whole game, but whether that was just to appease the Redknapp-loving media who are looking at the slightest sign of discontent against AVB's regime to blow out of all proportion I don't know!!
Tomorrow's huge for us, then we're facing 2 away trips against sides who are just starting to find their form after a dismal start to the season. I wouldn't like to call any of them but hope we can get min 5 and preferably 9 points. COYS!
- Dogstar Dogstar Dec 20, 2012 14:04 Flag
Hmm, people assuming that Parker and BAE will settle back into the squad but I'm concerned about their lack of match fitness. BAE especially who we know can be prone to error/lapse in concentration. Kaboul will be out for a while longer so let's hope Daws gets back soon because we need him in the team ahead of Gallas (I've been a fan of his but think his legs are now gone).
It'd be interesting to see whether Parker does make the first team back, but I'd never play a central midfield partnership of Sandro and Parker - both men effectively doing the same job, never works. Dembele should have nothing to fear because he adds that bit of class we need going forward - everything went through him the first half v Swansea.
- Dogstar Dogstar Jul 24, 2012 13:23 Flag
I have absolutely no problem with the player apparently refusing to train in pre-season or the club apparently refusing to budge on their asking price. I do think that a lot of the furore is generated by the media in order to play out people's beliefs that all football players are greedy mercenaries.
Now, in Modric's case who knows what the contract said. I doubt it'd said "player will be released if £40m is met" but rather "player will be released when club's valuation is met." The valuation can only be determined based on performances and injuries over a period of time after all. So to Modric he may feel that Levy is being deliberately obtuse by slapping an unrealistic (to many club's standards) price-tag on him.
I don't think anyone can deny Modric's commitment to the club while he's been here. I don't buy into the argument that a player should honour his contract when at any given point the club can decide to sell him. I'd rather not have a situation as with Campbell where he left on a Bosman and we were left with nothing, for a player where we could have got £20m for if we'd known of his true intentions to leave sooner.
While Modric has a few years left on his contract, I don't blame Levy for expecting £40m. However, I would not want there to be a similar situation as last year or with Berbatov, where it was all dragged out and affected our start of the season.
So, I think if an offer comes in for around £30m before the start of the season, then sell him and move on. Forget contracts, forget valuations, think what's best for the club NOW as well as long term. Don't f**k up our season over this...
- Dogstar Dogstar Jun 15, 2012 16:28 Flag
Ah but maybe that sums up Levy's thinking - Harry failed to eradicate our slump in form which does tend to happen afer the New Year. The last 2 seasons we've ended the year in Champions League positions but then ended the football season a few months later in the Europa League. If Levy felt that wasn't good enough, then he'd have been right. It's up to Harry to eradicate this dip in form and he failed, two seasons in a row, and both times this cost us Champions League qualification.
As for one game repeatedly highlighted I can actually name a few from this season: Arsenal away (decision not to play Lennon or bring him on at half time), Norwich at home (decision to start with untried strike partnership of Defoe and Saha), Villa away (we all know what happened there!!). Numerous occasions playing Bale up front and not on the left. Other games where we've not won he's just been very slow to react i.e. waiting until the last 5-10 mins before making a sub etc.
Strikers coming off the boil? Solution = Pienaar in 2011, Saha in 2012. Meanwhile, Newcastle bought Cisse and Everton bought Jelavic. So much for Harry's "wheeling and dealing." Another perfectly good reason for Levy to have lost faith in him.
Look I've been bashing Harry for the last couple of months but only because I knew he'd taken us as far as he could and the time was right to replace - with a Manager that can take us further. That's obviously up to Levy now, so if he messes this one up than he'll have 36,000+ Spurs fans baying for his blood. But, you have to take a chance sometimes and you know what? It might just pay off!
- Dogstar Dogstar Jun 15, 2012 09:15 Flag
Clearly Levy lost faith in Harry following the court case and the poor run of results that began with the Harry for England fiasco - admittedly this was more of a media frenzy, but clearly it distracted him and the players. Our pretty woeful performances and bad run of results did not come to an end until Hodgson was appointed England Manager and that removed the uncertainty. That cannot be just a coincidence.
I remember during this whole series of matches, beginning with Arsenal away, Harry was not coming out of his technical area like he usually does/did. The team was in dissaray and he was just sitting there, which I'm sure did not go unnoticed.
So whether Harry wanted the England job or not, he didn't seem able to manage the team during that period.
One final word, during the season he mentioned that the players weren't distracted with it (despite not knowing if he was staying or not), then a couple of weeks ago re contract negotiations mentioned it would be a distraction for the players if he wasn't offered a new contract!! Can't have it both ways, Harry...!!
- Dogstar Dogstar May 21, 2012 16:16 Flag
Fair enough but Arsenal seem to have gotten worse over the last few seasons. You finished 4th last year so by all accounts that was also a poor season. You've been out of the top 2 for the last few seasons so that would itself would suggest you aren't moving forwards, hence my comment about ambition.
Do you think it'll get better for Arsenal? Podolski is a very good signing, and maybe with Wilshire back you'll have someone who can take the game by the scruff of the neck. But as you said, it'll be tougher to get into the CL next season, with Chelsea, Newcastle and Liverpool all with ambitions to be playing in that league - and they are prepared to spend money to do so. I worry for Spurs that we'll end up falling behind, and I'm not sure if Arsenal have enough about them to hold their position next season.
- Dogstar Dogstar May 21, 2012 15:29 Flag
Oh dear, you really think Arsenal have any more ambition than Spurs? Failing to keep hold of your best players, lack of investment in the transfer market, last trophy success 7 years ago?
Yes I grant that you pipped us to 3rd but given we were only 1 point behind you this season whereas nowhere near last season, I'd be mindful about your team's own ambitions before talking about ours!! :)
- Dogstar Dogstar May 16, 2012 16:12 Flag
You're right for the most part John but actually I think there are a few cases where players will choose a club based on the Manager. Barry Ferguson for example joined Birmingham when McLeish was Manager because he reportedly enjoyed working for him when he was managing Scotland.
Years ago when Jol was our Manager, Danny Murphy first turned down the chance to player for us and opted for Charlton who were then-managed by Alan Curbishley. Reason? He did not want to work for a non-English Manager after having a tough time of it under Houllier then Benitez (which he'd said in a Sky interview). Bizarrely enough, he joined us a couple of seasons later! I'll bet Kaboul, Crouch and Defoe wanted to come back to Spurs once Harry was Manager because they enjoyed working with him (Kaboul has reportedly said so).
What's important though is Champions League, and our non-appearance could be a deterent to some players (especially big names) and could lead to our best players leaving us. Can't really blame them for that although I'm sure our fans would give Modric a huge amount of stick if he joined a club with a better record of sustained Champions League appearance.
- Dogstar Dogstar May 16, 2012 13:19 Flag
Hold your horses there. Arsenal are not finished, they've surpassed all expectations by finishing 3rd with arguably their weakest team for years. RVP may fed up playing the role as the talisman, or he may relish it and want to stay - they've already bought Podolski to play alongside which is a pretty astute signing in my view. I don't think any of us should make the mistake of writing them off next season.
Meanwhile, losing Modric would be a massive blow to us but I fear it'll happen whether we're in the CL or not. But, if we don't end up the CL then others would follow - this season was our best shot of getting back in the competition, so for players like Bale, VDV, Adebayor and Sandro, they know they can move to better clubs that have sustained CL status.
Would Dembele easily replace Modric? He reminded me more of Sandro than anyone else, albeit playing slightly further forward. Perhaps a Sandor-Dembele midfield duo would be frightening for any opponent, but as yet this is just hearsay and he may not leave Fulham, or may go to another club who can pay him better wages.
Newcastle were unlucky, we should look to buying a couple of their players. I wish we'd gone in for Cisse and wonder where our scouts were before he signed for Newcastle and we signed Saha?!?
I'll be praying for a Bayern win (even though I'm an athiest!!) on Saturday because we should be in the Champions League. I fear that Chelsea will fluke a win somehow - they seem to get the rub of the green more often than not.
- Dogstar Dogstar May 15, 2012 09:37 Flag
Not at the moment, no. Maybe it's my spiteful jealousy then that doesn't want those teams to be successful in Europe because they've had too much domestic success??
Or maybe it's because those clubs and their fans are all a bunch of w.....
- Dogstar Dogstar May 14, 2012 16:54 Flag
I personally don't understand why people take this jingoistic view to our club rivals in Europe. For one thing, Chelsea (& Arsenal) fans do not care about any other club teams supporting them and their fans would lord it over us big time if they won a Euro trophy.
Secondly, any success for our club rivals is detrimental to our own success, since the big name players would (usually) prefer to go to teams who are winning trophies and in the Champions League. So, again, why on earth support those teams as it's like indirectly going against your own team?
I'd certainly expect no Chelsea or Arsenal fan to want us to do well in Europe, so I do not want the any success for them. I'll add Liverpool, City and United to that list because until they stop being the so-called dominant forces at home and abroad, we'll just see our players leave for them and potential stars joining them instead of us.
We're an English club, yes, but with a great mix of continental stars, regardless of whether we're representing England. Chelsea may be representing England but owned by a Russian. Liverpool and Man U owned by Americans. Arsenal basically are a French club (hee hee!!)
- Dogstar Dogstar May 11, 2012 14:03 Flag
John people don't judge based on one game, i.e. after the Stoke defeat during the middle of that brilliant run I doubt there was anyone calling for Harry's head. It's the fact that we've lost so many points the second half of the season and when we've needed big tactical decisions from Harry he's fallen short - the Villa game is one example.
I'm glad you brought up Norwich, because that was a crucial game to win and he started with both of our sub-strikers rather than Adebayor and/or VDV. In that game he said he felt we were too open with 2 wingers but nowhere near as effective as Ade and VDV.
On a few occasions he's chosen to play with both Sandro and Parker in midfield at the expense of (a fit) Lennon which has invariable backfired, as it leaves us congested in the middle with Bale often drifting rather than staying out on the wing so we don't look as dangerous going forward or create as many chances.
Maybe Harry's only able to get his "best" team to play well in a set 4-4-2 formation with 2 wingers, one of Parker or Sandro and VDV supporting Adebayor. He doesn't seem tactically capable of winning games when that approach doesn't work, or when he tinkers with the formation / team.
So, you're right that we may have been criticising Harry if we'd lost against Villa after making the right decision - only because we should be beating a team so poor and he should be able to manage his players to win games whether they are starting as subs or playing out of position. Or be able to field a team that suits different tactics and formations.
Makes it harder to accept that he did everything he could to win that game, if he saw it as 2 points lost.
We can argue the toss about whether he should have brought Defoe on but surely taking VDV off for Parker was an admission that we weren't going to win the game? And why wait so long before making a substitution? That seems to be a trait of Redknapp - either making changes too late so the subs have little time to impact OR making the wrong substitution when we're up against it.
And, if Redknapp felt Defoe wasn't up to the task, what about Saha? Didn't he sign him up in January to help push us through to CL football? Clearly it's not worked the way he'd hoped but equally he has no faith in him, so it's another poor decision made by Redknapp. In terms of signings, he's been more miss than hit since becoming Manager.
My view is that, whether we get into the CL next season or not, the time has come to find another manager. This is not just about making a few poor decisions, but pretty much everything else that seems to have happened this year revolving around him - the court case, the England Manager fiasco both I think contributing to our severe drop in form. I also don't think Redknapp has what it takes to get us to the next level - there is no single piece of evidence that suggests he can deliver consistent CL football and silverware.
And why shouldn't we aim higher? Isn't that what Redknapp had in mind with the England job, lamenting now that he'll never get that job? Isn't the club always going to be bigger than one player, one manager? He's done brilliantly to take us from bottom 3 to the CL and if repeated this year that would be a great achievement. But, going by last season I don't think he'll be able to make us competitive in both competitions (let alone domestic cups).
- Dogstar Dogstar Apr 23, 2012 16:55 Flag
I take your point although I think the points difference between 1st and 2nd and the rest is the key John, and every season the gap between the top 2 and the rest seems to get bigger and bigger. City may have looked lacklustre but they have enough class about them to win games when they are not playing well - same with United. And you can't deny their class, at the very least consistent title contenders, at most the most successful Premier League team.
Class can be attributed to the player, the manager and/or the team. United and City have more world class players than we do so they can win games when not playing well - by producing that spark of invention or scoring that elusive goal when the odds are against them. Similarly, Ferguson is able to steer what some people have called the "weakest" Man Utd side in recent history on the brink of a second successive title. And the team as a whole just exudes quality, the whole is greater than the sum of its parts.
Time will tell if City will be able to maintain the same level. But they are certainly competing at the moment, a lot better than the rest of the league teams.