Liverpool Message Board
Dylan, do you have the link for that site, I lost it when I got a new laptop. I'd like to stick it out here if we can keep the threads coming and hopefully some more folks come back, but maybe another board would not be a bad idea if this one stays so quiet.
With you there Colyn. we can play better, and the good thing from my point of view is the areas where we see issues, or need for improvement I think are positions where either I'd expect the current player to improve over the season, and or we have an even better players currently not in the side. For example, under the current system I felt Sterling was a bit over his head as the right wing back, however he's a player who's definitely still learning and can improve, plus we have Johnson still to come back who I think would thrive in that role. The same goes for the number 10 slot, where Moses imo will improve as he settles, but with PC to come back we don't have to wait for that improvement.
On the league your absolutely right. I along with most pundits would have put it as a fight between the Manchester clubs and Chelsea for the title, then us, Arsenal and Spurs for the 4th slot. But Chelsea just seem to have something missing, City seem to struggle on the road, and the Mancs, just look lost. Meanwhile Arsenal are flying, Spurs look solid, and we're right in the mix. I usually say it takes 10 games for the table to settle, but it may take even longer this term. But I still expect the natural order to start exerting itself, which is why we need to keep up the momentum. We all I'm sure are having a good laugh at the Mancs expense, but end of the day they are only 6 points off the pace, which is not a lot to make up in 30 odd games we have left n the season.
Personally I'm a glass half full too. You can definitely get more in there, which is why I can be rather critical of things.
The results? Good
Score 3 goals? Good
Can we play better? Yes
Should we do better? yes, most definitely
Will we need to do better? You can bet your bottom dollar on that.
However on the flip side I do need to pinch and remind myself if I had been offered this position before the season started would I have taken it? Yup, without question but the league has a weird feeling this year. No bad thing but cross fingers we can take advantage of it.
I think we have been thinking alike this weekend Jason as i was going to start a thread called "Not Great, but not bad either", which is what I think you're saying, although as usual I put a bit more "glass half full" emphasis.
On not scoring 2 or 3 or 4 more goals, I got to give a little to the players. When you're that far ahead its really hard to keep up the same momentum from one half to the next. And, really it maybe more mental thing than a physical thing. However the reaction after giving up the goal I think is a good sign, as it showed not keeping a clean sheet really hurt, so they wanted to put Palace back under the sword.
On player ratings I'd pretty much agree with you, although I'd tend to be a bit harsher on Sterling. Don't want to have a go at the lad, as he's young and has a long way to go in his footballing education, however going forward I think he was our weak link. As you say poor decision making, but also just did not seem to find the spaces he should have been seeking out either. But he will learn.
But I'd also call out praise for Moses. Yes he should have scored when he got his feet tied up, and maybe he's just not spent enough time with Suarez to expect that low hard cross, but overall against Palace (and since he's been with us) I was impressed. He's not playing in his best natural position (out wide) and it seems he still does not have the perfect chemistry with his teammates yet, but he's direct, good on the ball, and finding the right pass, the right run, and imo really giving us another edge going forward.
Lastly however I'd want to temper expectations. The table really does not mean a thing right now. 10 games before it really starts to reflect things imo. However we are in a good position outright by looking at our margin over those we are likely to be fighting against for a top 4 finish, or compared with where we were just 12 months ago. Forget first or second, we just have to keep moving forward one game at a time.
Irony begins with me, the BR advocate and our current position, but I'm not one for complacency, and I like to view things 1 at a time, as they are..
We should have won that game 6-0, minimum, but again (though better) weren't great in the 2nd half, though for some reason decided to really push about 84"+ as if we were chasing a draw. Granted 2 well crafted chances/shots hit the bar in Sturridge and Moses, and they weren't the 2012 hit the bar type, but we definitely should have had more, much like Fergie's biggest thing, scoring more goals and goal differential.. Just look if we'd won 5-0, we'd be clear by 2 goals, and close to City's +9 which will get higher as they climb. If ever a year where clean sheets and goal diff will mean everything, this is it..
As for the players, I thought some were terrific: Henderson / Skrtel the choices as MoM for me. I've often said I'd like to see Jordan groomed into a box to box because I think he possesses a lot more in his locker than Lucas, and boy did he show it. His pace and work rate make it very difficult to go around and through him, and he allowed Stevie to play more comfortably. Skrtel looked his 2012 form and Sakho was commanding. Enrique was his usual Jekyll and Hyde, good then terrible turnovers. Sterling did ok, but needs much better decision making/end product in the final 3rd.
It was nice to see Alberto getting a run because Coutinho is still week's off, and he's really our best like for like, just needs to get up to speed and cope with the rigors. Suarez and Sturridge great obviously, Mignolet very very good, almost too good because of some poor turn overs and fouls given. There were quite a few moments/scrambles where a team like Arsenal or City will smash them home, and that's my problem, and I'm glad Brendan shared the same.. For those who hated his positives even in bad games, surely you can find enjoyment in his criticism after victories. He wants 90" of perfection & we're a work in progress.
Guys, my fear is that sitting back only gets you so far. Teams have already sussed that pushing hard on the full backs and in central midfield will give us problems. We've seen it every game and you can only ride your luck for so long. I fear we'll lose a couple and then drop like a stone.
keeping the ball is the way forward, for me anyway and we can fiddle systems all we like but at the end of the day iot comes down to personnel and their ability. I still think we're missing something in the middle.
lets see what happens in the next game.
Tactically speaking and in regards to the formation/personnel, what I think would be great, and certainly something we could do with the existing squad, and even better when Glen or Kelly is ready to assume RB again, is what Napoli did 2 years ago, where they ran riot in the CL as the surprise team, and caused havoc in Serie A.. 3-4-3, which also essentially breaks itself into 3-5-2 or 3-4-1-2 depending on the run of play, but allow for tremendous coverage wide, and counter attack play..
For us it would be:
This creates all kinds of chaos in all areas of the pitch, makes it very difficult for the opponent to play through the middle, and allows for a lot of freedom of the 2 main front players, who in our case can interchange with Suarez/Sturridge, where Napoli just really had to get Lavezzi and Hamsik on the ball and find Cavani as the focal..
With Glen back, Lucas available, and the competition at CBS, we'd have Skrtel-Sakho-Agger at the back, and could eventually work in Coutinho as well, when fit.. I found it to be a tremendously exciting formation/style and even last year without Lavezzi (granted Cavani is another planet as is Hamsik) they finished just off Juve, and I happen to think we have overall better personnel. I do prefer 4-2-3-1 at the end of the day, but for 3 CBs this is my favorite especially seeing a top team I like, deploy it.
Well, what I've done, as an fyi, and if you guys happen to see them, is save the link directly here as an icon in my favorites bar at the top of my screen, so it's always here no matter what yahoo does to change it..
Where there's a will, there's a way!
Colyn/Dave, I hear all your points. I am not 100% convinced of the 3-5-2 and we were playing good football before but it definitely suits the current available personel, of that, I think we all agree. Colyn, I think it is a fair comment that we have conceded a lot of the possesion we had last year but it does look to be a straight swap for silly decision making in possesion from our defenders and it seems to be getting better results so I am a little bit lost in it all really.
Whatever the formation, I think we look at our best with Suarez-Sturridge as a partnership, not with one out wide for the other but as a traditional tag team. When PC is fit, I want to see him playing behind those 2, not out wide, maybe in some games but not in general. For me that only really leaves the 3-5-2, a 4-1-2-1-2 (we dont have the players for really) or a 4-3-1-2 which I dont think anyone has really done since that awesome mid noughties Milan side.
probably the best way is to get a link out there to those people. The reason I got lost was the link via Yahoo disappeared and search engines wont find it either.
Not really, unless you want to get yourself involved with twitter, which can make your head spin, along with getting into some unsavoury discussions, profanities, and a bunch of insane idiocy..
To be honest, I think if us regulars just continue to come on here, it will come back to life. I've actually seen armchair post comments on Liverpool related articles where fans are able to comment, so I know he's out there, and I've also seen Ron as well. Colyn has made his way back, and I think some are just lying in the weeds, until we build up a thread to 15+ comments, like the existing one I just started..
Next time you see an interesting / or contentious article with Liverpool involved, check the comments below, and I'd bet you'll see at least 1 or 2 of our former posters, and you can urge them to come back here. For another option, I actually hold my own discussions with Reds from both sides of the pond in direct messages on Facebook, if you're a member and interested, we can always include you and anyone else here who'd like. Facebook is a cool way to do it, since you can see / learn about who you're actually interacting with on a more personal level...
Er....I have to disagree there. We've had the results but I've been far from impressed with our performances thus far. First half against Stoke and that's it. Every other game we have been hanging on for long periods. Possession stats say we don't have as much of the ball as the other team. The grit, determination and resolve is great but it will only get you so far.
Rodgers wants to play possession football and we don't do it. I've highlighted above why I don't think that's the case. I don't see anyone in the squad that can really turn it round either. Gerrard can't play a possession game from where he is currently playing. And I don't rate Lucas any higher either. It is that simple honestly. Allen believe it or not is the best fit style wise but there's issues that he and the team need to resolve for him to be fully effective.
From what we have available I understand the 3-5-2 but that doesn't excuse the very poor execution of playing out from your defensive line.
Do any of you lads post on other message boards you'd recommend? Unfortunately this board seems to be slowly dying, and I'm getting to the point where I rarely come to see if anyone has anything to say as most days there are fewer and fewer posts. It's really a shame, because until Yahoo decided to cut all links to access the boards, we had quite a diverse community here posting various points of views.
Most other boards I've looked at are either moderated and you end up with only Reds all agreeing with each other but little healthy debate, or open boards that quickly descend into trolls trying to wind everyone one up, and again healthy debate, or diverse opinion just goes out the window.
I'd love to get some of the old posters to come back here, but as that does not look likely to happening wonder if there are any better options out there?
Hobs I agree with almost all of that, although not sure I'd want to see the 3-5-2 every week if we had a fully fit squad. The starting 11 above is surely one that would give many teams a headache, however with all our defenders fully fit, I think both Johnson and Enrique are mobile enough to be able to join the attack but still cover their defensive duties. And, by dropping either Skrtel or Toure it allows us one more attacking player on the pitch. Perhaps deploying Moses along with Daniel and Luis in a 3 man front?
Colyn, I think the statement we don't have the players for it is qualified with the style you expect us to play. Based on results we in fact do have the players for the system, but its transformed us much more to a counter attacking side, rather than a possession based side.
But for me this change has less to do with the change in system, rather than the availability of players. The simple fact for me is that our best possession players just are not available. We could go back to 4 at the back, but the possession would still down without someone like Agger to play out of the back, or a PC to dictate the tempo from the center.