Liverpool Message Board
I thought it was a penalty first time I saw it and still think the same. The keeper caught him, simples. You can also tell the way he went down.
As for foul play I thought the two tackles in the United, Chelsea game were far worse. Vidic was deliberate and cynical. while the other was just down right wrong and deserved red every day of the week.
I apologise for this post in advance - I know this is nothing new but wanted to post it to get it off my chest.
The narrative in the british media around LS has been unbelievable. All of the ex-footballers I've listened to say it was a nail on penalty. The numerous replays I have seen clearly show the keeper missing the ball and catching Suarez. Even Lambert couldn't hide his smile when the reporter, after listening to him say that he didn't think it was a pen, asked him if he would have been disappointed had it not been given at the other end. He didn't answer the question.
And yet the headlines are as if Suarez and bitten, racially abused and dived all at the same time. The Sunday Supplement have just had a discussion where one journalist starts by saying there was no contact and therefore it was a dive. When the other three journalists point out there was contact and it was a penalty, you think that might change the direction of the discussion. Of course not. We go on to hear that we shouldn't be too harsh on Suarez because this "dive" wasn't as bad as some of "his" others. Even, most graciously, that Bacuna rolling around on the floor clutching his face trying to get Sturridge sent off might, arguably, be as bad as Suarez "winning" the penalty.
Let me write that again. A player play acting to get a fellow player sent off might (just might mind you) arguably (of course there's some doubt) be as bad as Suarez being fouled and given a penalty!?
Of course all last season we heard that Bale was unlucky to be booked 7 times for diving. That the slightest touch is enough to bring down the modern professional footballer travelling at speed. Oh, and wasn't it funny when that nice Mr Neville fell over with no one anywhere near him.
The media witch-hunt will continue until Suarez has left the country.
Sorry rant over.
Villa played 4 in midfield but they weren't flat. That meant that they were always finding space between our lines. No doubt the team set up was wrong and done so to fit Suarez and Sturridge. Lucas? I seriously have my doubts
Rodgers has problems to solve.
1. A midfield that isn't strong enough and
2. How to accommodate Suarez and Sturridge.
Both need sorting to a degree this month in my opinion. If Everton turn over West Brom on Monday we slip out of the top 4. So yesterday was not a good day at the races at all.
I agree with pretty much all of that. Only two things I'd slightly disagree with - I thought Toure had a good game - lots of last minute blocks - and I think Cissokho isn't terrible. He's a limited nuts & bolts full back (not wing back) who plays to his standard. I think the sad thing about GJ is that we know how good he can be. Surely he's playing with an injury.
Very much our worse display at home since Southampton. We've had three stinkers this season - Hull, Southampton & Villa. With the table so tight, we can't afford another one. Everton is a vital match now and is a must win. That's going to be difficult against a very good blues.
As soon as I saw our team sheet and figured out how it would set up, be it 4-4-2 or even 4-4-1-1, with Suarez slightly withdrawn, I knew we'd be in trouble because I remembered exactly how Villa took us last year at Anfield, and did the exact same thing masterfully. This was the worst performance at home, since Southampton, where I sat in agony for 90 mins, only there, we had 0 fullbacks.
4-4-2 is for teams in the bottom half, content to lump it up, OR have insanely good wingers and central midfield, see City - Yaya/Fernandinho, Navas/Silva.
To be fair to Lucas, for the 20" he lasted, and the change it represented, we saw the value of playing to our strength of 3 players in the midfield, and he's not even that good, so that speaks volumes. Fortunately Allen looked healthy, so now if Lucas is really injured, we have Allen, who I think is vital.
Coutinho isn't a winger, and he can't race down the side, so he's always cutting in, and Cissokho, for all his efforts, just isn't good, and only 1 leg, so no width there, and Glenda just gets continually worse.
If Skrtel hadn't played today, I'd have thought we played a 0 man backline, because Toure wasn't at the races, Glenda/Cissokho are terrible, and I counted 6 clear chances, where Villa could have humiliated / torn us apart, with Skrtel making the last ditch slide tackle or clearance. The fact in other forumns I see, people suggest dropping him, or playing two lefties, is baffling.
Henry was sat right there, and looked to be about as agonized as I felt in Sept., or on my couch today, and hopefully that sparks whatever they're doing/looking at, as far as midfield, to get done. We lost out on Jorginho to Napoli for 9M, which was a joke, M'vila is out there and would join.. Doing nothing, or waiting for the "right player", will cost BR / FSG far more in the long run by missing Champions League & losing Suarez, than spending now. Great players cost $$ Chelsea of all teams added ANOTHER good CDM, in Matic for 22M!!
Yea, I'd venture to say that's about 99% sure to happen, barring any other CB's getting injured, or until Sakho is declared 100% fit. I think it's always been the plan anyways, unless he totally outshone someone, and surprised Rodgers, which was unlikely w/ Skrtel, Sakho, Agger, Toure & Wisdom..
Who knows.. may be our only move of the window..
Yeah I'd agree with that. I would always pair Alonso with a monster. Benitez put Masch there so for once I agree with his logic. Sadly I'm a member of the Alonso appreciation society and a sucker for players of this ilk. Those that can sit in the middle between the opposition penalty box and half way line and still look like they have all time in the world. Molby are Xavi are other examples. To me these players are the best that can be. Yes the Ronaldo's and Messi's do the spectacular but they don't dictate or run games. They win games for sure and can turn a result in your favour but they don't command games.
Gerrard on the other hand fits somewhere between the two in my opinion. Not the silky technician that is Alonso but capable but not the out and out monster either. That is part of Gerrard's problem too. He can do many job and that sometimes interferes with those players around him.
I'd be all in favour of a midfield of Gerrard, Henderson and Allen given the choice. Lucas to me is a squad player.
i also agree on your Coutinho comments. The lad needs to learn some composure. He'd be on another level then.
I don't mean they're the exact same player now, of course not, just saying that in this new position, Gerrard is resembling some of his abilities, and we're seeing even more in Gerrard's locker as he needs to adapt. Alonso is/was one of a kind, and I agree, his calm on the ball, and dictation of the game is unmatched. I do believe Gerrard is a better out and out defender, especially watching both LFC and Fail Madrid regularly. He's a far more rugged/physical tackler, and always heading things clear in the box. Xabi is less likely to do these things, but excels elsewhere of course.
Either way, I think it shows that Rodgers has lost faith in Lucas back there, and that when Allen comes back completely, and he's in training now, he will probably work in, and then probably push Lucas out. With Gerrard in the controlling role, and Allen / Henderson's energy, pace, quickness and pressing, it could represent an upgraded style to what we do, and what we've seen.
This can only be a good thing as Suarez and Sturridge look seamless together, and Sterling has been unplayable. Only Coutinho needs to step up more, with better passing decisions, and learning how to shoot into the net, rather than around it, or at the keeper.
i'd agree with everything bar one point. Gerrard is nothing like Alonso. As far as subtle movement, keeping possession, time on the ball and perhaps most importantly the discipline AND the ability to play that deep midfielder role. There is something silky smooth about Alonso, even when he passes the ball. The ball travels in a direct / smooth way, the weight is perfect etc. Gerrard isn't like that. His skills are different, more direct and aggresive.
Well, it seems as if Rodgers is convinced as we are, as the last game vs Stoke, which is tough even for City with Yaya/Fernandinho, with Gerrard playing the holding / controller role, and will continue there, per BR. Everyone takes this comment differently, but with Gerrard's ability to bomb passes forward on a dime, he's almost identical to Alonso, and he is easily the best / most physical tackler we have in central midfield, not to mention, I lose count of how many times he is the one heading balls away from corners. So, that said, I'm content, though having Lucas going forward, until Allen is fit, really doesn't offer much, other than him pressing and winning a ball or two.
As for right back, if you're going to get caught out, even like Sagna and Walker do, you better at least be doing something productive in the final 3rd, otherwise you're a complete waste. Considering Johnson, on his day, is the most technically gifted rb in the league, with ability to use both feet, shoot, dribble and cross, the fact he is literally doing nothing, makes him so worthless at the moment. Even Cissokho looks superior at the moment. The guy gets in crosses, is taking shots (an own goal resulted) and seems to recover ok. More than anything he works hard and tries, despite his short comings..
I can't say the same about Glenda, and he can go to West Ham or Swansea this summer for all I care because nobody in the top 6 would replace their RB with him.
Johnson can't defend. We've known that much for ages. Well he actually gets caught out of position which is really bad for a full back. But add to that a more recent dip resulting in being a bit complacent and switching off it's not good.
I also think a settled central defensive partnership is critical. Injuries have upset that of late and I think that's part of the goal leaking problem.
Set pieces though? Wow we're bad there, no doubt.
I still don't think Lucas is the answer. He's ok when it's all in front of him but when it all get's squeezed he disappears. He's slow and really clumsy at times. When we have the ball what does he do? I don't know. Yes he sits and gives easy balls etc. but I would never say he makes us tick. No where near the level that Alonso used to do.
I don't think so.. I was very charged up about these things as well, and you'd think after 21 matches, some would have sorted themselves by now. Champions, get these things sorted out. Look at Arsenal, granted they haven't won a trophy in 87 years, and usually get hammered by the traditional big 4 now, but had always had weakness against lower sides.
They've toughened up big time in the middle and at the back, and are 1st / 2nd in clean sheets. Chelsea were leaking goals, and have 3-4 straight clean sheets.. We can't consistently do it, in part yes, due to injury at CB / FB, with Skrtel being the bedrock, but still, the mistakes are little league, and the effort is what drives me crazy.. see Glenda.
Our midfield, for 4-5 games, with Allen and Henderson, was night and day, and while we can probably score 4,5,6 goals many times, we could also lose 5-4, 6-5, and as entertaining as that is, it's also scary and not a good formula. It shows how good Allen really was/is, and scary to think what would be without Henderson!
The defending is a worry no doubt. It's been a great season so far but things that really bug me ...
1) Not closing down wide players/allowing easy crosses in
2) Defending crosses/set plays (although we were generally better at this yesterday)
3) Putting pressure on throw-ins (other teams often nick the ball off us from our throw ins whilst we stand and watch them put theirs into play).
4) Teams can still run through us in midfield (that has improved
Just being a Monday grouch I guess!!!
I thought he was ok too, actually made a few crunchers, but again, he went missing at times. I heard Nzonzi's name far more, for breaking up plays throughout the match, and while Lucas has been better, I agree, I just don't think he's the CDM that is the spine of a team we aspire to be. Not to mention, Gerrard played the sweeper and was making tackles, and headers as if he'd done it all his life.
City - Yaya/Fernandinho/Garcia
Chels - Ramires/Mike/Essien
(On our #$%$ Spuds - Paulinho/Coupoue/Sandro
Arsenal - Flamini/Arteta/Wilshere
Too many games and players that are past him. But back to the topic, Glen really s.u.c,ks !! I'd welcome Kelly starting, and I hope Sakho is back soon, Kolo had a great opening 3-4 games, but wasn't up to it at Stoke, especially goal #3
He's disinterested and just flat out terrible now.. Nothing above average. Cissokho isn't very good at LB, but the guy runs his socks off, and tries, 2 things Glenda doesn't do.
Kelly should be more than fit by now, and he offers a different threat going forward with his height and crosses, not quite as gifted, but no nonsense defending.
I'm sick of Glenda, and I really hope the rumors are true about M'villa or Windalujm for midfield, because even on a decent day, Lucas just doesn't allow Gerrar/Henderson the total freedom they need. Allen is missed..
Please buy a right back to put a rocket up Johnson. Another goal from the left where he makes no attempt to get close and stop the cross. Talented player who's decided to go on holidays early.