Manchester United Message Board
- 3 Replies to Eric Cantona
The ridiculous thing is that in every single match you can lip-read players effing and blinding when a decision doesn't go their way, or even when a shot goes agonisingly wide. If all the players were wearing microphones every game would sound like an episode of The Osbournes.
This is the absurd thing about Dave Steer's viewpoint - swearing goes on all over the pitch. And let's not forget the crowd who are perfectly audible and somewhat given to colourful language. Should they all be banned from games? And God forbid that cameras and microphones ever enter the dressing-room at half-time! This is all a storm in a teacup. When will people get real? Gerrard hired a gangster to shoot a man in the face, he battered a bloke in a bar, yet he is still a cuddly role model, whereas Wayne utters one of the most commonly used words in the English language and is crucified by the middle-class media and outraged of Tunbridge Wells types like DSteer.
The camera zoomed in on Rooney, not the other way round. They were basically doing the old Paparazzi trick. It is a red rag to a bull as they are fully aware, and they got what they wanted: an outburst from Rooney. Your analogies are wide of the mark. Rooney did absolutely nothing to any other player, he just did what many other celebrities do when you stick a camera in their face.
The use of 'foul' language on the pitch is a bit of a difficult issue unless we have polyglot referees, given the amount of foreign players who get away with stuff every week. A friend of mine insists that he once saw Vidic say "govno yedno" (which means "you piece of shit" in Serb) to another player! Maybe Rooney should imitate Father Ted and just say "feck" instead....
When will the idiots who run the FA be replaced / removed from running our game. Rooney has admitted his guilt requested that his ban be reduced issued an apology ....What else does he have to do ???
I seem to recall when he was on England duty and he was swearing at the cameras about the England fans on his way off the pitch NO action was taken by the FA (And even FIFA didn't poke their noses in) as I guess that they thought his absence would be detrimental to the England team ....HYPOCRITES
- 1 Reply to Eds
i think we are so quick to take responsibility away from ppl these days.
& this is the cas again with rooney.
lets blame the cameraman or the media.
if rooney doesnt act like an angry idiot then theres no prob.
what next? u can celebrate by doing a wanka sign to the camera?
its ok because most kids now what a wanka sign is.
its the camera mans thought for getting to close.
its like taking the blame away from your rooneys & crouchs for cheating, by blaming it on the girls who hand it to them on a plate.
its still rooney/crouch choosing to cheat.
we are turning into a blame everyone but me for my actions nation.
the blame culture is rife.
Well, for a start, it is arguable that the camera did it to Rooney (a stitch-up), rather than the other way round. The way the mic was picking up was particularly unusual as normally a goal celebration is seen, but isn't generally heard in that manner. It's a paparazzi trick. The TV people and the Media generally need this sort of stuff to keep the public interested.
The kids round here are OK, so I won't rise to your bait. So they know more swear words than the pampered ponces where you live. Most of them are decent kids, as is Wayne Rooney.
One of the things that has always interested me about the middle-classes is that they were the architects of both Nazism and Fascism. The psephological data on this is indisputable - the early membership (without which they couldn't have grown) of the NSDAP and the PNF was almost exclusively middle-class. Even today the head of the BNP Nick Griffin is a 'nice' middle-class boy (public school & Oxbridge). Like you and DSteer he despises the working-class, and believes that children should be taken from working-class families and brought up by middle-class ones. Anyway, as a Chelsea fan you should know plenty about Nazis: Combat 18/Headhunters, etc.
Stefan, learn to read. I said that the middle-classes were the architects of Nazism and Fascism; meaning that in origin they were middle-class movements. This is acknowledged by every diligent writer on the subject.
The fact that these movements get support from *some* working-class people is irrelevant. You get working-class people who admire the bloody Royals.
Stefan, you perhaps shouldn't jump to conclusions so easily. I was involved with anti-fascist groups for a number of years. So I can easily attest that your "utter tripe" jibe is based on a lack of knowledge.
Let's take Combat 18/Headhunters & the notorious Chris Henderson for starters. Henderson despite his claims to being white and working-class was actually the son of a Lord and was educated at Charterhouse public school. Ian Stuart Donaldson of Skrewdriver fame was also a middle-class boy. Don't be deceived by appearances.
The NF's leadership was almost totally middle-class: Colin Jordan, John Tyndall, Martin Webster, Griffin, etc, etc.
These groups did attract working-class support, but nearly all of those people came from Tory-voting families and consequently had anti-working-class politics.
I misread the final sentence in your response to Robert. Apologies for that. That said, regardless of their middle-class origins, you cannot deny that the members of these extreme right groups today are primarily working class.
You can go on about 'middle-class ponces' all you like. I think you'll find that the reason that many middle-class people have a problem with those from the working class is because they have been blameless victims of ASBO-esque behaviour. I know I have.
"you ... despise... the working-class"
No. I may indulge in caricatures but I don't in any way detest the working class. The closest I come to that is being irritated by those who wish to identify themselves as working class telling the rest of us that they are somehow better than us.
What I think is that a division of the population into working or lower, middle, upper class is completely archaic. Like religion, if we didn't have it as a hang-over from history we wouldn't invent it now. What made sense 100 - 200 years ago doesn't make any sense now. Economically and socially the old populations have been completely mixed up. We're mostly all middle class but with an underclass. (And I don't associate the underclass and the working class together.)
It seems to me that most people who call themselves working class today have a strong political awareness and instinct to the left of the spectrum, and it is the desire to make politics which leads to the advertising of their working class values, rather than vice versa.
I agree with the thrust of the claim "we're all middle class now" and I think football belongs to the world, not those who would artificially seek to promote an archaic form of British politics.
That said, I've found your contributions in this debate very intelligent, without agreeing with all of them.
- View More Messages