Tottenham Hotspur Message Board
Who says harry is an un-justified winner of manager of the year? Just stumbled across this on wiki pedia and i think it shows what an excellent job hes doing;
Top 20 managers of the club's history
Based on win % in all competitions
Manager Years Played Won Win %
1 Frank Brettell 1898–1899 63 37 58.73
2 Arthur Turner 1942–1946 49 27 55.10
3 Harry Redknapp 2008–Present 92 48 52.17
4 John Cameron 1899–1907 570 296 51.93
5 David Pleat 1 1986–1987 119 60 50.42
6 Bill Nicholson 1958–1974 832 408 49.03
7 Arthur Rowe 1949–1955 283 135 47.70
8 Fred Kirkham 1907–1908 61 29 47.54
9 Jimmy Anderson 2 1955–1958 161 75 46.58
10 Percy Smith 1929–1935 253 109 46.38
Dont know is thats gunna be overly readable, but its basically saying hes currently third for win percentage in tottenams managerial history! The best thing i can deduct from this, however is tat he is the best in my life time! (granted i was only born in 1989 but still ) Anyway dont know if this has been shown before, just thought id share :)
o and heres Jol's; (12th)
12 Martin Jol 3 2004–2007 150 67 44.67
It should be what have you done with the resources you have. IE 'managed'.
So, to me its racing top class sports cars against production models. You expect the sports cars to win - if they don't that is a failure of management, rather than success on their part. But if you take a Fiat Panda and beat a couple of sooped up super minis and maybe one or tow sportier models to 10th place, then you've done well. If you did the same with a Tata Nano, then you've had a brilliant season.
As a racing / gambling analogy, if a red hot favourite does well, its expected and largely down to the pedigree of the thing running. If an outsider does it, it has run out of its skin.
The LMA/Yahoo article explains it (the one re Hodgson and the fact that he had less resource in way of skill and money)....
Wenger, Fergus and Ancelloti all started off as favourites.
I think 'arry was quite clever as he kept referring back to an totally underperforming team and drumming up the idea of us as underperformers. The pundits were saying that we had a false position when he joined and expected us to be challenging for Europe anyway - so his achievement wasn't (IMHO) as good as Hodgsons.
But we're going round and round in circles here...we obviously see it slightly differently...
PS I know that injury list was at the seasons end - that's why I said google 'injuries' + team. Look at the history of injuries for each team
Thing is Fab, that Wenger has not improved the club at all - still not an EPL title, still not a CL Champion - just sitting around in 3rd place. So arguably, he's just done what most of the other managers in the EPL have done - maintained the same place - no improvement (I'm not saying he's a bad manager - just that he's not done that much).
The only competition 'arry really had was Roy Hodgson - and it could have gone either way - in reality they both deserve the title because they have both done a lot for and with their club. Look at where Spurs were just over a season ago when 'arry took over, and by the same mark - look what Hodgson's accomplished with what is a pretty small and essentially un-extraordinary squad.
At this stage for Wenger to get the award, he is going to have to either win the CL or win the EPL - I don;t think holding ground does it.
That is the thing Rambro.
Wengers achievment is viewed as par for the course and that is why he is overlooked IMO even though to my mind he has achieved the greater goal and against greater odds. You only have to look at Lpool to realise that a top four place and a good run in the CL is not a God given right.
Anyhow i give up.
I hope however i have made my point.
That list of injuries was pleasant reading John as that is the shortest it has been for a while! What a shame the season has finished. Tutt.
Naturally it is not the volume of injuries that gives you MoS and that is not my sole argument but only a small part which i think should be taken into account when summing up the achievments of each individual manager.
If achieving 4th place makes Harry worthy of the award then why not Wenger who has achieved third and the quarter finals of the CL and arguably done so with his hands tied?
Anyhow it seems my efforts to sway the yidddish mindset getting them to agree to rid hellish Harry of said award in favour of wiley wonder Wenger have all come to nought even though i have fought like a lion.
Emirates cup it is then.
Yeah, Lennon for the best part of the second half of the season...we've had to do the makeshift back line on a number of occasions (remember when we all thought we'd be in for another CB during the Jan. transfer window? Bassong was out, Dawson was out, King was out...and Woody was a non-starter from the off...so we played Corluka and Huddlestone a few times...then there was the right-back issue late on...Corluka out, Hutton on loan...recalled an untested kid (Walker), who did admirably well (still wonder why Walker and not Naughton...differing loan deals maybe?). Modric's broken leg as we were picking up steam (our Fab if you will), that set us back a bit.
So, Fab...its a wash mate. Yes, your lot did finish above ours...but I say that that was the expectation of the majority going in to the season...how many people thought we'd finish 4th...far fewer I bet you! I guess if we comapre last season to this seaon we both improved (you from 4th to 3rd and us from 8th to 4th, but if you look at that improvement in terms of absolutes then we take the cake...4 place improvement over a 1 place improvement...our highest place in the Prem ever...our highest goal tally...lots of firsts that can easily be directed to the leadership (both of the team and the club as a whole).
End of the day, we'll probably not come to any agreement, I see your point...but we've felt the same pain, and we've achieved above and beyond expectation, and as I think Big G said, yours, Utd and the Chavs its been business as usual.
Based on your argument Fab, surely SAF should come before Wenger then? The loss of Ronaldo's goals, Rooney in and out of fitness among other players. That big red nose to contend with day in day out. This is a far more constructive reason than yours!
Just google 'team' +injuries for any of the EPL teams.
'Critical' Injuries - Pool would point to injuries with Benyoun, Torres, Gerrard... Utd to Ferdinand, Rooney (and the whole of their defence back in Dec).
BUT isurely it's not the volume of injuries that gives you MoS? Yep, you lot did well with the problems you had - and I personally think that you'd have been pressing for the title had you had a full squad for more of the season - but Pool would argue they would have got 4th and Utd would claim the title. And then Avram Grant would have to have got MoS - simply for getting to the FA cup final with his injuries.
You didn't reply, because you didn't have one. Lets face it. Instead you come out with the usual insults and Bushisms like "Dumb as a bucket of rocks". You might be able to insult a redneck from Oregon with that, but not an Englishman.
This board needs good old Galway Mike back, to add a bit of good spirit and educated argument.
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