Liverpool Message Board
Why would we go with a 5 men defence when we are at home? Negative negative..... Why are we chopping and changing? It looks like we never start with the same strikeforce, even if we score and win the previous match. Bellamy has been the most threatening of our strikers since Suarez's suspension, but KK starts him one match and drops him the next... Maxi has been on a rich vein of scoring, but is overlooked even for the bench. What is the plot KK? Why so negative at home? I would have expected to start with 2 upfront. At this rate we will have 9 defenders on the pitch when we play the bigger teams. I don't want to sound alarmist, but KK is making some puzzling decisions.
We play 3-5-2 in my Sunday team, sadly, the sunday league is where it is best left. We always play it because it helps nullify a long ball (the scourge of the elite hungover defences) by allowing 2 forwards to be marked tight with a spare sweeper. Its a counter attacking line up and if your wingbacks are fit it can make for flowing football. Its not as though our full backs have a problem with getting forward in a 4-4-2 is it?!
It is made even worse by Stoke playing 4-4-1-1 as it means you have 3 centre halves defending against 1 man with Walters sat in the hole, the centre half cant go get him so it drags a midfielder out. We started off with it and thats fine but as it became apparent that Stoke were happy to defend, we really should have changed our line up to suit the game. Lots of possesion up the pitch but no way in? Then Maxi or Craig are your men. Want to play Hendo, Downing, Enrique and Johnson then play Carroll, thats what he does. We didnt even muster a shot on target for 75 minutes. Kuyt is in the worst form of his life so to rely on him alone was a bit odd.
I dont want to criticise Kenny but this is the first time I have been annoyed with him. In all the other home draws it was about great keepers or missed chances, today it was a tactical error, no question.
- 1 Reply to Hobsey
Well said Hobsey - no-one should be above criticism, including Dagger.
He may be under a bit of pressure from the owners & is therefore playing it safe - but a faint heart never won nowt.
I think the owners defo want 4th and it is rapidly slipping away - I'd hate him to get the boot in May and regret not giving it a go.
Are you losing the plot yourself? Not 5 in the back but 3. Johnson and Enrique played wingback and spent most of their time on the edge of the Stoke box.
Bellamy can't play two 90s back to back he said it himself due to his knees and he's happy with how he's being managed
Maxi is a skills player who does best against technical teams hence starts against Chelsea but not against the Stoke giants.
- 1 Reply to dsteer_lfc_68
Dsteer, heard what you said, and I know you always back the team and manager, but on this one, I really think KK has to take a big part of the blame!
You can say Johnson and Enrique played most of the time in the opponent half, hence we effectively played 3-men defense, but by the same token Skrtel also spent most of the time up front, so we played 2 men-defense?
And I don't quite follow your logic on Maxi. He is a skillful player and has shown forms. He is good to play in the Chelsea game but no good in player a lesser team at home?
Bellamy cannot play 2 90 mins game back to back - but that doesn't mean KK couldn't start with him and let him get a few goals before resting him.
And how can you explain Kuyt playing the lone striker, a player known to have no speed, poor first touch. Don't get me wrong, I like Kuyt and he can play striker role .... but not on his own. He will benefit from the presence of Carroll, as we have seen after Carroll was introduced. So why play Kuyt as a lone striker for over 60 minutes?
The whole line up was a negative set up. By playing 5 men at the back and a lone striker, KK was hoping to wear Stoke down and then introduce Bellamy and Carroll to finish hopefully with a 1-0 job! That is negative! Why can't we put the best team on the pitch, be aggressive and score a few goals in the first half then rest the key players? We were playing at home for Christ's sake!
Just one more thing, over two games, 2 draws only get you 2 points, but 1 win and 1 lost get you 3 points. In fact, in terms of points gained, there is no difference in winning 1 match and losing 2, as against drawing all 3! It pays to play aggressive football, and it also explains why although Arsenal have lost more games, but they are above us!
You'll worry even more when he tries the same thing at home against City in the second leg of the Carling Cup. If he does I think this time City will easily win. Only chance of silverware will be gone.
I do think when he says 'we worry about ourselves and not the other team' argument is somewhat undermined when you see him changing the team formation to accomodate Stoke's aerial threat. Also it gives him a chance to keep Carra from whingeing - and it back-fired spectacularly. I would say we are the sixth best team in the league and I am afraid that's were we are going to end up playing the likes of Downing and Kuyt in games.
- 1 Reply to Loki
All that Kenny has lost......is his striker......for eight games......due to the manipulations of a little hypocrite and liar. But this too shall pass. Funny to see the mancs here and offering up their free unwanted opinions , they were sure absent of late whilst their side were losing. Reckon they won a match so now they're all experts again.
Yeah , the draws are frustrating. We really deserved a better fate vs Stoke. The effort is there , just not the finish. No one is conceding anything though.
The Reds are still in good shape to advance in both Cup runs , home matches for the lads.
I'm very concerned with how we're playing of late..
We're not able to beat these lesser teams. I don't accept that they raise their game to match us.. Are we so weak that we're not able to overcome them?
I'd love to see whats going on during training, because something clearly is wrong there..
Or is it something more basic than that? We've got strikers who can't / won't score. So why are they still at the club? At this rate we'll be out of the Europa again and it apprears aour aspirations are no better than than qualifying foe the Europa..
With the players Kenny has brought in: Carroll, Henderson, Suarez... none of them know where the goal is.. or if they do they need glasses..
In particular to Suarez & Carroll and especially Carroll whose got a chance to make a name for himself.. He's squandering it. He has a perfect opportunity to bang in goals and make it a hard choice not to leave him out.. Instead he's making it very easy to be left out of the squad..
Putting it simply our strikers aren't fit for purpiose..We can bang on about being loyal to the players. Thats all well and good when the players play out of their skin and impress us.. As things stand they don't deserve our loyalty one bit..
In fact I'm annoyed that we're once again not thrashing these lower placed teams.. Arghh..
No world class player is gonna wanna come to us with our form.. Instead they'll go to Spurs or the like.. We missed out on Van der Vaart, Silva who'd have been amazing for us..
- 2 Replies to John S
Is this the same John S who said this about 9 months ago that KK would leave in a month and after I bet him £100 he wouldn't he disappeared?
F@ck off loser you haven't got the balls to put your money where your mouth is you pussy!!
What a waste of f'@cking shoe leather you are t!thead go away and expire for all our sakes!
When KD came and turned around a near hopeless situation into one of the best 2nd half of the season recoveries, we thought he was the best to take us forward. He could still do it only if he realises his mistakes and change tactics.... He needs to ensure that as far as possible he has his best available 11 on the pitch always. No experiments, no negative approaches even at home, no sentimental attachment to failing players etc etc...
dont be daft, no-one on here will say anything bad about Kenny.
If it was hodgson then there would be 100s of fans queuing up to slate the teams results, performances etc.
Ive never known Liverpool fans to ignore something that is so blindingly fooking obvious. Kenny is out of touch and clearly out of his depth in the modern era!
But as most Liverpool fans still live in the 80s it would be considered some sort of betrayal to say anything negative about Kenny! Must be some pathetic fear of being reprimanded!
So in a nutshell, The Kenny brigade all have one thing in common now and that is silence and this pathetic fear of being reprimanded!
Its an absolute joke that your team has scored only 24 goals in 21 games!! Thats less than some of the relegation fodder especially taking into consideration the money he has spent.
Kenny has brought shame to your club and is slowly turning you into a fooking laughing stock.
Whatever Kenny did for Liverpool over 20 years ago before walking out on you counts for sweet FA now, and the fans who believe this is the man to bring glory to anfield are living in dreamland!
Worth debate Vuvu - but I suspect you'll have some outraged responses from those that think you can never question a LFC manager - but I think you have a point & I think that if Rafa or Woy had been in charge the same questions would be getting asked.
Here's a couple to add to your tactics question :
Does anyone really, realy (truthfully) think Carroll is ever going to make it - or are you actually just to embarrassed to admit he is/was a waste of a lot of money. I would have preferred to sell Torres and not have replaced him immediately.
..Henderson & Downing (esp) - again, was it £36M combined - honestly does anyone back-pass more than Henderson? Does anyone come off the pitch as sweat free as Downing?
What is sad is we have lost the likes of Lucas through injury and have treated the likes of Kuyt and Maxi very shoddily this term - just to prove a point with our 'new boys'.
What concerns me is we felt the need to bring back Shelvey, which indicated desperation as far as I'm concerned & don't have one attacking reserve player we can 'trust' to make a debut out of the reserves.
Kenny needs to take a couple of risks - a win and a loss is better than 2 draws - todays intention and line up was a disgrace for a home game.
THOU SHALT NOT BLASPHEMOUS THE KING!!!!!!!
True Kennys tactics can leave alot to be desired somtimes and I would gladly start Maxi and Bellamy over Carroll on any given day.