• Liverpool Message Board

  • Jason Jason Oct 9, 2012 19:52 Flag

    Suarez in retrospect.. ?

    I had actually intended on starting this thread last week prior to the Norwich match, but then he went off and decided to have a field day at Carrow Road, only, he can't play them every week

    So, moving on to my point, or question... having seen how wildly inconsistent he can be in the final third where he can score some wonderful, world class goals, and when in the right mood set them up too, he has games like Stoke where he is completely wasteful, drifts into the wrong/bad areas, doesn't look to pick a pass, and attempts the impossible... it begs the question..

    In hindsight, if you had your say back in the summer when PSG, Juve and Madrid seemed to be sniffing, some very seriously, and could have gotten more than what we paid, let's say 30M (vs his 23-24M), would you have considered or actually sold him? This is under the pretense that we assume he would have been the same player we expected and what we see week in and week out, which is always a magnificent talent, but not always an end product..

    I know in a way it's a loaded question, and he said he loves the club and wanted to re-sign, so that became hard to ignore, and it's also hard to ignore the fact that he "could" score 30 goals easily, if he did some things differently, but I just don't know if we'll ever see that..

    As to who you might have wanted to buy, that's a whole different story, but perhaps we could have had Higuain, maybe a duo from Barca ie - Tello/Villa, Llorente, Dimaio, Schurrle, Lewandowski, even (cringe I'm going to say it) Torres back for less (for 20 you couldn't be too upset w/ money to spare) and plenty others who are true # 9's.. you could go on all day.. Yes there will be some who say the adaptation period/growing pains to life in the EPL, but to be honest, we see less and less foreign players struggle these days than I can ever remember.. Granted not center forwards, but a couple of fragile little midgets who are lighting it up: Mata, Hazard, Oscar, Carzola.. even Podolski. Then Jelavic, Cisse, Petric, Pobgrenyak who just slotted right into their #9..

    It's hard to say, but for me, obviously everyone will know how much I rate Edinson Cavani, easily best striker in the world for me, followed by Falcao and Van Persie, and previous to Cavani obviously when he was ours, Torres, who I was inclined in many days to say one of the most prolific strikers we'd ever see... So that type of player is what I personally value in a 9.. which Suarez clearly isn't and most likely never will be..

    So, in the end, I love him for his passion, effort, hard work, some brilliant days, but at the same time, I almost find him intolerable on days like the past one vs Stoke and I would have entertained the thought for 30M for sure, especially if I could have had any of the above names, or perhaps gotten 2 for 1..

    (I'm hoping that in addition to some interesting answers, this will maybe prove to be some magical karma thing and he goes on to score 25-30) Life, ironically, can be funny like that sometimes, and in this case we could use that laugh..

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    • But as other have mentioned I think you have to look beyond a single player. The fact is we currently operate with a 3 man front line, and at least one midfielder who can find himself in an advanced position. So is it fair to ask why are these other players not also scoring more goals? Are they not good enough, and so if a good offer came in we'd be better off trading for better personnel?

      For me the answer is no, all are operating in a new system, and many of the supporting cast are new either to the club, to top flight football or both.

      We've got Borini who I know is beginning to frustrate many, but how many minutes of prem football did he have before coming to us, so did we really expect him to light things up immediately? Sterling, a bright spark if ever I've seen one, but why not give him a hard time for not netting any league goals so far? Same for Suso.

      Seems to me we've got a lot of inexperience in the positions we'd expect goals from. But just like many said over the summer about how much time was realistic to see results from BR, why are we not applying the same standard to the squad? Yes we want more goals from LS, but he's part of a system, and until that entire system, including some of the youngest and least experienced supporting cast players start working as the system was designed we're not going to see the best from that system or Suarez.

      But hey 5 goals from 7 games, is that really such a bad number? That's 0.71 goals a game, or on track for 27 league goals this season. I'm not complaining.

    • It is an interesting thread. First of all, trouble or not, he has scored 5 of our 9 league goals this season so he isn't getting too much help. I'm not sure we would have been able to attract Higuain, Villa etc having just sold our best player if not at all with him still here! Torres has not scored anywhere near as many goals as Suarez in the same premier league period anyway and who's to say he would fit our playing style these days? Or any of them for that matter?!

      When you are an underachieving team (and we are, by any stretch of the imagination) the last thing you want to do is sell your best players, we need another top striker as well as him, if not 2! Sometimes I wonder if his 'greedy' nature is more to do with the fact there is nobody else in the team capable of hitting decent numbers, more goalscoring players around him would force him to pass more often! He isn't an out and out no.9 and I dont know why he is expected to be, he clearly is meant to play in a free role or as an inverted forward, there needs to be someone else up there to tap them in or hold the ball up. He is playing there alone out of necessity as far as I can see. None of this would be a problem if others had stepped up and put some goals away, it is definitely unfair to put the burden on him of scoring enough goals to win us games alone.

      By the way, when you talk about Pogrebnyak, Cisse etc, you should really take a look at the premier league top scorers table, I see just one player ahead of him and thats Demba Ba, so if hes playing like he is now and scoring at this rate over the season, imagine what will happen if he does step up to the level we hope could come. By the way, Edinson Cavanni has only scored 1 more goal then Suarez this season but I have to disagree about best striker in the world, Messi plays up front these days in exactly the same position as Luis, hes not bad! Or are we not counting the 2 monsters in Spain anymore these days because they play in their own seperate league!

      I think Radamel Falcao has pretty much proved he is the best 'no.9' in the world and he does it in a far superior league too! I think most Chelsea fans would agree!

      • 1 Reply to Hobitez
      • You mention Pogrebnyak there hobs and I've seen him this season with Reading. I've liked what I've seen to be fair. He's quite a lump and likes it to feet. He's rubbish when it's coming at him head height (take note Reading). But on the attack he comes alive and is down right selfish about being in front of goal when the ball comes in. He always finds space too.

        I feel we missed a trick there. I don't know if he could reproduce his Fulham form for another PL side but I know someone who's dangerous in front of goal when I see one.

    • It would have o be a very good offer in my opinion but I still think my answer would be "no". As Robert says we sell our gems and replace them with rusty bags of bolts. Not good.

      For me Suarez is not a centre forward or a No. 9 in teh old fashion sense. He's a no. 10. Remember Peter Beardsley? Same kind of player. Never prolific but had ability in spades.

      What to do?
      Get a proper No. 9 in there to play alongside Suarez and I think you'll see him start to blossom more regularly. At the moment it's like he thinks the scoring duties rest completely on his shoulders when it doesn't but with a real finisher beside him he may actually / subconciously realise that and put his efforts into being the creative force we know he can be.

    • luis suarez such a fantastic player on his day unplayable

      but when things don,t go his way his temperamental side shows this manifests itself in the theatrics we have witnessed over the last few weeks

      so is he vilified by referees maybe so why is he vilified i personally think this goes back to the suarez/evra race row

      i honestly believe that referees are making decisions based on his past misdemeanour's

      we all know his past but surely referees should be impartial and make decisions based on fact we have all seen decisions that were stick on free kicks, penalties or sending offs that referees fail to give

      it used to happen to cristiano ronaldo and it was down to the speed he played the game at just like suarez he was kicked from 1st to the 90th minute and was eventually forced out of the english game went to real madrid were he gets more protection from referees and in return scores and creates more goals than he ever did in the EPL

      thats my 2 cents worth

    • Much as I don't like Suarez (and I don't) you shouldn't be thinking about selling him. One of your biggest problems in recent years has been losing many of your best players and replacing them with worse. If you want to improve you need to replace your worst players. I know the temptation is to think the grass is greener at the away ground and that player over there looks fantastic in the highlights, but that's no reason to suppose that he'll replicate that form week in and week out at Anfield.

      I should know. For every £20m+ Mata or Hazard or Oscar we've bought there are half a dozen others we've bought and then old on at a large loss.

      Keep the little ****.


      Robert

      • 1 Reply to Robert M
      • Couldnt agree more. I dont really understand the focus on Suarez. Sure he causes controversy, thats the managers job to sort that out, if he can stop him diving....spitting....kicking, biting, abusing then we 'could' have one of the top 10 forwards in world football. That cant be said about most of our team. If I were to come in as manager of that team I would be looking for more goal scorers, a challenger for Reina and a left back, everywhere else has good competition, Suarez is our best player, selling him would be silly.