Liverpool Message Board
I thought we'd have the debate here as many a thread seems to settle into this area at the moment.
For me I'm not the biggest fan of Lucas, never have been either. Here are my reasons.
Firstly I find him one dimensional. He can disrupt opposition attacks provided the game isn't too intense. He may win the ball and give it short. After that I'm struggling. In those high intensity games I find he goes missing. When the pressure builds I find that attacking players just seem to breeze past him. He seems very heavy footed to me.
Also when we have the ball what does he bring to our game? Not a huge amount in my book. He doesn't seem to have a great passing range, again it looks heavy and he's a million miles from being the player we need. That is one that keeps possession ticking over , always available, the out ball for everyone and the ability to probe etc.
It's because of these limitations and this years poor form that I'm afraid to say that he has a lot of work to convince me otherwise of his overall usefulness. I would also say that good players tend to attract some transfer rumours but in all his time I cant remember a single snippet anywhere. That alone tells me that people look and think they can do better elsewhere.
Any thoughts anyone?
Agree with you wholeheartedly. I was a Lucas fan when he first came to us although he was vilified by the majority, I championed for him thinking he'll come good. Its unfortunate he had the injury he did but Rogers has to stop kidding himself and face the truth, Lucas is not the player of 3 years ago.
- 1 Reply to MichaelM
I'll admit I was one of those that didn't think he was up to much way back then. I've kind kept quiet because there's a lot of support that's grown for him and the stats suggest he's doing a good job. I don't actually like these kind of stats, I tend to follow my eyes and to be honest he's never really convinced me. I guess I've been spoiled by watching Whelan, McMahon, Molby etc. I also remember Souness and co.
To add more to my argument in a midfield 3 I think you need to have a bit more in your locker. Lucas plays as a spoiler type player, breaking up opposition attacks and then moves the ball on. Or filling in gaps. That's fine but when you have the ball you need to keep it. That means in a central three the deeper lying player really needs to be cute on the ball. He needs to make a team tick. There's no room to hide. Does Lucas do this? No, emphatically no. Add that to the weaknesses he has in defending then we have a problem. The fouls he was giving away against Everton were driving me nuts. His yellow card record speaks volumes to me.
To further this point I can live with a lack of pace provided they offer something else. Ability on the ball and subtle movement as an example. Lucas? no. How about passing ability and vision? No.
Basically he's one dimensional and struggling with that side too I reckon.
Napoli and the Italian game would suit him better I'm sure.
I think you know my stance, and ironically, while I wasn't here on the boards these 5-6 years ago, when Lucas was absolutely tortured by everyone, and dire, I actually told friends to support the lad, as I saw things in him, that I see in Jordan now, such as good pace, work rate, effort and the desire.
Aside from the work rate, and desire, I just don't see these things in him anymore, and I don't even think it's his fault all together, but such is life. Medically speaking, from what I do know, and seeing it so often in the NFL and American sports, tearing the ACL, can be career ending, even if you come back, and it was evident that when he came back 2 years ago, he wasn't right, and I feared he'd hurt something else, and he tore his thigh muscle.
I think these have had dramatic effects on him with regards to his legs, footwork and movement. If he was still able to regain those, and still quite young, 25/26, then we still have a very good (not great) player. But the things you eluded to, cannot be changed, such as vision, passing range, offensive skill, and for me, back to the medical/surgical part, he cannot elevate to win many headers or aerial duels, that I even noticed Sterling and Allen competing for.
In short (my medium), he's luck to get in some timely clearances, or sliding challenges, with a good knowledge of where to be, but that's it. I do know Rafa was suggesting he'd be interested in bringing him to Napoli (along with our whole team), and 1-2 other Brazilian/Italian clubs, but nobody of lofty stature, and at this point, because his pace isn't heavy, just flat out slow, with no good movement and the other limitations, makes him a 4th choice, or important squad player. On second look he was okay vs Spuds, but had Redknapp still been there with all that talent, we know the setup would have been different, and he would have been a target of their paciest /creative player(s).. It's sad, but truth really..
- 1 Reply to Jason
Its hard to believe that he was a golden boot winner before he came to us. Hopefully being dropped will buck his ideas up.....with Allen starting to look like the player he was before his injury, Lucas's place is really under threat.